View source for Pan - Determinism Question And Answer Period (9ACC 541224)

'''Series:''' 9th Advanced Clinical Course (9ACC)

'''Date:''' 24 December 1954

'''Speaker:''' L. Ron Hubbard

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Thank you. Any questions?

Female voice: In this process you gave us yesterday the "Have the body say hello," Vaughn and I ran through some quite interesting things. Started off by having a mock-up, which of course was mass, and that didn't work. And so this morning I had her just get the body to say hello to her. I think that was one of the processes you gave.

Um-hmm.

Female voice: Now it's only the idea of the body saying hello is all that's needed.

Um-hmm.

Female voice: Well, I know, since you brought this up, I was run an hour and a half before, on just a spot in space saying hello; and, my gosh, that's when just everything happened. And that was the time I felt so horrible the next day and all the stuff had gone by and all sorts of things happening. But with this other deal using mass it didn't produce that at all. I mean there was some stuff going on, but not - .

I see.

Female voice: ... what went off was just using the space.

Well now, you'll find that there's a hollow spot in back of the body. And if you will let one of those hollow spots - at least - there's at least one - if you'll let it say "hello" backwards - you know, have a - have a spot in back of the body say "hello" backwards - you will discover some of the more interesting spaces.

You get why that is? A thetan has always come in on the body on the back, you see, and nobody has ever said "hello" to him.

There's quite often a machine pulled in there, which is one of the more interesting things you run into with this process.

Big, big juicy machine with valves, tubes, endless belts and every other thing.

Male voice: I got to report one thing this morning in processing, I said, "What's happening?" And she said, "I just discovered that that ridge out there in back of me, isn't a ridge. It's the hemisphere of the Earth."

No kidding!

Female voice: I was having a lot of trouble with my mother though, speaking, and she'd been stuck three fret back of my head. And, finally, I got her going away and going away and going away until I got her located, actually, just saying hello and so on, located in Denton, not Denton, Somerset, and I thought, "Well what the heck is this ridge?" There it was and then it dawned on me it was the Earth!

Trying to as-is the Earth, here, all in one process! If you do that again and you're trying to as-is some part of Earth, why, make sure that it's probably Washington. Will you?

Female voice: Yeah. Okay.

Washington or Moscow or something like that are very legitimate targets because they're trying to make a target out of everybody. So overt act motivator sequence to give them a two-way communication flow would only be the humane thing to do.

Well, there's another gag on that which has been passing, is very amusing, is put out a remote viewpoint opposite every electron in a small area of wall, and then have the remote viewpoint in each case trace back to the point of origin of that electron and make a perfect duplicate of it.

You'll leave a hole in the wall if you do that. There will be a hole that somebody else could come along and put his finger through. Of course, there are an awful lot of electrons in the wall, but that's one of the preventers that has been erected to keep people from as-ising the playground. You get the - you get the fact now, you should, more clearly than ever, the introduction of significance and so forth into this as well. You make any damn thing say hello if you want to. It's of no importance. The mind's automaticities on which we have depended to a marked degree an oddity, the mind's automaticities shouldn't be counted upon by the auditor. In other words it - he shouldn't count on the - some automatic machine suddenly turning up a lot of aberrative locks. It would be silly. Why should you do that? See.

Male voice: Might find original cause.

That's what the machines are trying to do. I imagine guys have all kinds of machines sitting around. You're right, to do just that, find original cause.

We had - we've had more cute cockeyed machinery here lately.

Female voice: I came across cockeyed machinery, sat on the top of my head, oh, two or three months ago. I couldn't think what the red light was flashing on and off. And I took another look and it was a machine, had a fabulous setup, with a little sort of cup, like an egg cup only larger and a glass screen like it, and then a thing on top with four prongs and the red light flashing on top of that and this thing could have gotten tied up to my teeth and head, and I worked it out and put it onto the carpet behind in the room, and it was frantic, the light was flashing on and off I saw the other lead had lights on it, so the auditor says, "hold on, take a look" and we ended up somewhere along Venus and there was a whole blinking card system, and this card system had another light series and the one which I saw was mine was flashing madly. So I took a look at that, and I didn't see the photograph, that was the - seemed to be the place for a photograph. But it was a wave then, which was very clear, and then the thing at the bottom which I saw in English, it said, "Due to report back, 6th of June 1954. And this was 28th of May or so - so I blew that whole old lot sky high. That will show them.

It's a cute thing if you see some type of machinery of that character, the frailty of it is such, and the energy from which it is built is so flimsy, that all you really have to do is have the preclear make it say "Hello" or "Okay," preferably "Hello," for a while. And this is something that an automatic machine never says, and it will just blow wider and faster and harder than anything you ever saw. When it's - when you find a preclear with a line going off to nowhere, and he is unable to tell you what is on the other end of the line, you happen to be curious, just no other reason, why, just have him make that missing end of the line start saying "Hello" or "Okay" or 'All right" or "I did it," or anything you want to make it say, and the next thing you know it'll come into view and explode or come into view and melt or start to tear apart or the line will get very, very active. All kinds of strange things will occur. But that's not the point. You just have the guy go on making it say "Hello" or something of the sort.

Actually, a person only gets into this complications and games to end games and so forth, when he's been denied a lot of games. You stop and think of the number of games you were probably denied when you were a little kid, probably denied a lot of games. And so you finally had to buy the standard game. This we call sanity.

In running somebody exteriorized, remember you can use the communication processes very easily and use them with considerable benefit. However, if you get somebody exteriorized and continue to direct communication processing at the body, the fellow will yo-yo quite a bit and flip around and he gets unhappy about the whole thing.

We're processing an impossible dead-in-six-months case as I have mentioned to you before. This person is exteriorized sitting on easily during the session, sitting on the roof of the house and running the processes, and so on. But he still has very solid lines down to the body, and he's - when he jumps around, the body really jumps around. If you ask him to turn around, why the body will twitch in the direction of turning around. You never saw so much lines in your life. Well every once in a while, you'll get somebody running the body with lines. This is an old one. He'll just run the body like mad. You'll think the body was a horse and he had to have reins on it. You'll sometimes tell somebody to be three feet back of your head and find he'll pull his head back this way. Find he'll pull his head back. Matter of fact, quite commonly that is a way to look at a person, tell whether or not he's going outside. He's just stretching these lines, you know.

And they'll go on out. And then - .

Male voice: Slingshot effect.

Yeah, they'll stumble, they'll do something and this line will recharge. Because those are tractor beams. Now, when you energize a pressor beam, it means that it gets longer. So it'd push him further away. This is doing a bunk. You've simply energized the fellow's pressor beams and he goes out, zoom, you see. Compulsive exteriorization as Jack called it.

Now, tractor beam activation is an entirely different affair and when you activate or put some juice into a tractor beam it goes pown, see, it contracts. And a thetan has continually, earlier on the track, victimized bodies with these darn fool tractor beams. He'd put a tractor beam on a tree and around a guy's head, see, then back off and energize it. And the guy would come right on in the tree or something of this sort.

One of the more interesting overt act-motivator sequences I ever found in anybody was a fellow who had made a habit of finding girls around some cave age on some planet or another, he'd find a girl bending over a fire and would bang her face into the - into the flames. He had been very worried about his mother, and very worried about his wife and very worried about all sorts of things. When I got him exteriorized and ran enough drill to get rid of a few lines, why, these doggone facsimiles were pulled in tight against his own face, naturally. His concern about others was dictated by an overt act-motivator sequence. He was unwilling to experience the communication which he himself had originated.

Who hasn't exteriorized yet in this unit? One, two, oh, you. Now, I'm going to say something real ornery and real vicious, but I make a practice of trying to say in front of people's faces what most people say behind people's backs. Every time you take a pretty girl and you try to yo-heave her around on exteriorization, she's got a valuable mock-up.

Female voice: No.

Yes.

Female voice: I don't agree.

And so she isn't going to do anything really active about moving out of the vicinity of this mock-up at all. Because she knows very well that somebody else will come along and pick up the mock-up and throw it in the river and muddy it up just to pull a gag on her if she happens to walk out of it. She knows an awful lot of things. But these things as they exist, exist into this. I know that's not true.

So therefore you process a girl under this condition, so forth, one of the ways to process somebody under that condition is to get enough origins of communication so they're not sitting there waiting for some other arrival of some kind or another and they get over their anxiety about it. Origin of communication. They'll put it into all kinds of phrases. They'll say it's a - they're waiting for a compliment or they're waiting for this or they're waiting for that. But, they're waiting. The actuality is they have a very desirable mock-up and you have to exteriorize them practically with a brickbat. And you run into this more darn times.

I processed a very, very beautiful young man one time. He was a very nice looking young guy. We found out in his last life he'd been a hunchback. He wasn't going to let go of that mock-up. No sir!

Yes.

Female voice: Well, if you want to process, process getting the answers from just a spot in space, wouldn't that exteriorize just as quickly as getting an answer from a body? Seems to me.

I've been running a test on this, and I find out that where exteriorization from the body has been very, very successful, it was actually a spot picked just back of the body.

Female voice: Yeah.

With the, as I told you earlier, the communication sent in that direction.

Female voice: Sending communication out.

Yeah, communication further back. Although your preclear is sitting there - .

Female voice: Yes, you practically do.

Huh?

Female voice: She'd have to get - .

Male voice: She can't find it.

Did you?

Female voice: I don't know. Well, have a spot just back of your head say hello to a spot about twenty feet back of your head.

Female voice: I know I want to. But, I want to - .

Come on, do it.

Female voice: Well I can't hear it from my back.

Nobody cares whether you hear it or not, just have a spot say hello, hello, hello, hello from about two feet back of your head to a spot twenty feet back. You do that easily? All right, now be the spot twenty feet back of your head and have the spot two feet back of your head say hello to you.

Female voice: Sort of.

Hmm?

Female voice: Sort of.

What's happening?

Female voice: I don't know it's there.

Two spots out there.

Two spots out there.

Female voice: Uh-huh.

One saying hello?

Female voice: Uh-huh.

All right, now be at the spot twenty feet back of your head and have the spot two feet back of your head say hello.

Doing that?

Female voice: Well, part of me anyway.

Good. Good. A little bit rough to do?

Female voice: Oh it just gets my head throbbing.

Female voice: Depends on hard, it's hard to get the first spot to say hello.

Well, just have it say hello some more. See, we just add too many significances to it. It's only necessary to get that spot saying hello backwards, further back. You get the idea?

Female voice: Yeah.

You can make it do that.

Female voice: Yeah. I can - I think surely if I had a while to just concentrate on all the same spot without having to say hello.

Eventually be back there looking at this spot saying hello in order just to get the communication.

Female voice: I'm out three-quarters.

Female voice: You can even try to see the mock-up.

You can get to - any time you add too much significance to any of these processes, you slow down the process in general. How to slow down a process - get significant. It doesn't mean - significance actually applies to well, let's see, what could you call it exactly. It would be an untruthful rationale. That is what we mean by significance more than anything else. Or an unnecessary rationale.

There is actually a rationale. Don't let the fact that significances don't process bar you off from the fact that rationales don't exist - they do exist. The rational plot of this universe and the rationality of a thetan are quite true. There's nothing wrong with these things at all. I mean, he did enter a certain role, you see. He did go through a certain series of agreements which did wind him up in a certain state. This is ne plus ultra rationale. Now, the closer we can come to the basic agreements, the less we have to worry about these - the outlying agreements, see. The workability of SelfAnalysis, by the way, depended upon this process, Communication Processing. But, look how crudely it's done. Very crude with putting masses in there and we're doing all sorts of things. Furthermore we're not having the mock-ups talk, you know. There's more holes in the process. And yet even that crudely, it works. Well, we're getting closer to an actual rationale by processing just spots, spots saying hello and spots saying - .

By the way, you know you have a thetan just mock up spots around about the place and quite often his vision will clarify or he will exteriorize. This is the first time he has ever had anything he can duplicate. He's duplicated somethingnesses for so long.

Now, as far as handling machinery, I gave you the process. You just have the boy make the machine say hello, and so forth. There's nothing to handling machinery. If he finds a communication line or feels one or suspects one, and that seems to be getting in your road and you want to get that significant about the whole thing, well, have some part of it start saying hello or okay or goodbye. And having consigned your process to that function, for God sakes keep it there. Don't go changing your mind about it. Maybe you were wrong. Well, that's tough on the preclear. It's tough on you from the standpoint of time.

Very often you say, "Well, now, let me see." You're unthinking about this whole thing, we'll say, "Well, we'll have this fellow's nose," you see, he seems to be having nose trouble so we'll have this fellow's nose say hello. You know, you're just dull that morning. You didn't get your coffee or something. And all of a sudden ping-pong and he's out in front of his face. Very confused and quite upset about this whole thing, unable to get back into the body because of a pressure flow. Of course, you could ask him to mock up a beam, grab hold of the back of his hair and move - and climb himself around to the back of his head. It's quite - quite interesting. It works. You can get the guy, you've at least found him.

Male voice: The astonishing part of it he knew where he was.

If I could - if I could train you to capitalize even on your own errors, I'd really be a happy boy. You can do some wild things with processing without damaging the case today. The thing to do is know the right things to do, you see, before you go off doing the wrong things. But having done something wrong - you'll occasionally do something that's a real boo-boo and you'll say, "I wonder what the hell got into me," you know. The guy kept standing up and screaming and it was 2:00 in the morning, and you've already had a warning from the police. Such a weird situation has occurred. The relatives are just about to storm upstairs again and bust up the session or something of the sort and you will always - all of a sudden give him some command which is a real boo-boo, see, real dull, you just skid entirely. Well don't be afraid of doing that, to hell with it. So you did!

You say, "All right. Give me some places where your mother isn't screaming." You suddenly recognize, insight, he's sitting in birth, see. And you say, 'Anything to stop this damn screaming," you know. Only he started screaming on an entirely different process, you know and he - that hasn't been run yet at all. Oh, he looks around and he gets kind of confused in directions and that sort of thing. And your mistake could be to go on to some other game to remedy the game you just unremedied, see. For Christ sakes, peg yourself at some game and finish it, see. Walk out of the game you got into before you go on to another game, otherwise you're just paralleling the MEST universe confusion.

In other words, if you told him to find some places where his mother wasn't screaming, although this interrupted some things you had - were having the door say hello or something. And all of a sudden he started screaming and you said to him in desperation, "Find some places where your mother isn't screaming." It's a wild shift, see, something of this character. You did it, it's late. All right, so you did it. Now don't, doggone it, go on and find - go on and start lock scanning the Auditor Code break or the something. See, that would just - .

All right, now let's just lock scan that. Now, you're once, twice wrong. Don't keep making yourself wrong all the time. Another thing is the aplomb with which an auditor ought to be able to sit up and run an error straight through right according to process. They should be able to run an error with the greatest aplomb you ever saw. Straight out of the textbook sort of aplomb you know. Just exactly the thing to do at that moment.

You reached over and tapped your preclear on the knee when he was in a boil-off. He immediately stands up and screams at you. So you scream at him, with aplomb. Completes the screaming session. Say, by the way, talking about MEST universe processes, processes which process the MEST universe by dramatization, by walking and so forth have a very limited workability. You'll understand this if you don't already, someday when you try this out. But there is a process which is apparently a very dangerous one, which an auditor would rather think up - they seem to come by this easily. They have so often process - they have so often in their life taken a screaming, screaming victim and tried to shut him up, that the suppression on screams is very great, and once in a while - practically anybody will come up with this sooner or later - the way to process a preclear who is having a bad time is to take him out in a deserted place and have him scream. This is an interesting idea. Well, I thought it might be profitable to take a check over some of the cases that had done this. One redeveloped some migraine headaches that had been cut off by Straightwire. One developed laryngitis. And none of them got Clear.

It seems to be - it's one of those processes that sounds good. Sounds good.

Male voice: Sounds good if you started yelling.

If you said start screaming, you'd have - you have an offbeat process, you see.

Female voice: It's going the other way.

Oh, brother is it going the other way. You're winding him up every time he's ever killed somebody and been killed and you're asking the preclear to as-is Lord knows how many masses in how many forgotten locations across how many between lives and entrance to MEST universe bridges and through how many priesthoods and, oh man, this is a rough deal.

Let me give you another slight caution here. You'll find that a preclear occasionally stops making a spot answer. And he will start, I don't know - let's see, what's the name of those miller's wheels, that roll round and round - he'll start milling energy. He'll just start rolling it around. All of a sudden an energy mass showed up, you see, and now instead of going on making a spot saying hello, he will make the energy mass move in some fashion. He just starts making it move in some fashion, as an actual greeting or something.

And he becomes - he's unaware of the fact that he has stopped the process. He's unaware of this fact. Therefore we still want to find out from the preclear every now and then what he is doing.

It's something that sneaks up on him. He wouldn't do it by malice aforethought. It becomes a very interesting process, but it's not a process at all. It does...

Male voice: ... bad time by being first in one location - another - or another right around him.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's a - but he'll just start milling around energy without any idea in it or anything of the sort. He's just pushing around energy. It'd be as therapeutic to go out - oh, it'd be more therapeutic to go out and have him push around some rocks, or stir some glue. It'd be more therapeutic.

The other caution is, is let's not forget - invent some games. Invent a game. You can run the guy clean out through the bottom of a barrel on his games. And he becomes very, very sour. You might not recoguize scarcity of games without a little bit of very sharp observation. It mahifests itself in an abandonment of something, or "I don't have to care so much about that now, do I." Or, 'Actually you don't need other people at all, do you." Or "Well, I guess life - I guess you can live peacefully." The fellow makes some sort of a - starts making some offbeat, little bit sour consideration about life. You've at that moment run into a scarcity of games, bang.

(end of lecture)

[[Category:Lectures 9ACC]]