View source for Demo of Knocking Down a Tone Arm (1MACC 591110)

'''Series:''' 1st Middle-American ACC (1MACC)

'''Date:''' 10 November 1959

'''Speaker:''' L. Ron Hubbard

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A demonstration given on 10 November 1959

Thank you.

Okay, did you learn anything?

Audience: Yes.

All right. You think you can carry out that assignment?

Audience: Yes.

Well, it's curiosity, wonder in your minds that I would ask you such a thing – just being polite.

Now, I'm going to give you a demonstration of some sort. I don't quite know whether to give you a demonstration on a disrelated subject or not. Auditing this one is falling off a log. And I don't want to run it in front of you and simply stir you up because it turns on automaticities. I don't want you to have to do this as a prelude to auditing this Entering A Mind Process.

By the way it's second hour, second day, First Melbourne ACC.

But I don't want you to get the idea that you're supposed to do this on each other to audit this particular process that you're going to run. Got the idea? You don't have to do the thing I'm going to start giving you demonstrations about – just to run the process you're going to run tomorrow. But sooner or later in this course you're going to have to do this with some of the people in this course.

And I would like – just like to give you a demonstration of knocking down a tone arm. Crude.

Maybe if I showed you something about this, why, you'd take a little more confidence in being able to sit there and rawrr at a case because this is quite interesting.

But with that proviso, would you like to see a small demonstration on knocking down a tone arm?

Audience: Yes.

Now, knocking – knocking down a tone arm in front of a group like this would be about eighteen hundred times as tough as knocking down a tone arm just in a private four-walled, just entre nous sort of session – be real rough. And I frankly have never tried to do it in front of a group. Might be attended with fantastic consequences. But we'd have to ask the question of who's got a high tone arm?

Well, this is a real risky thing we're embarking on, I'm not just trying to be dramatic because if you've got a high tone arm I'll knock it down. Don't – don't volunteer in vain.

Male voice: About 4.0.

Have you got a very high tone arm?

Male voice: About 4.0.

About 4.0, that's not awfully high.

Who's got a tone arm riding about 6.0?

She's got one about 4.0, huh? Well, we'll knock a 4.0 down. Okay, come on up and sit down up here and let's see what we do. We won't necessarily just do it on one person here.

Okay, now because my voice is very loud and so on, we will make it even worse by putting it on tape, you know. We will give you the crown of thorns here. And we'll take our good friend the electro-physical-psychometric detector as it's known briefly and – I've got a girl here reading at female Clear.

Male voice: She cheated.

Female voice: It worked.

Male voice: Nice work.

LRH: Well, squeeze them anyhow. Squeeze the cans. Just give them a squeeze. All right, give them another squeeze.

Is this meter operating?

Give them another squeeze. That-a-girl.

Give them another squeeze. That's better.

That's it. Okay, let me see how active this thing is. Now, just sit right there. Think of death.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Yep. Yep. Set too high. Okay, thank you very much. Stop thinking about death and come up to PT. All right.

Now, what we're interested in here more than anything else – we were interested – was knocking down a tone arm. And it's been my experience however that they very often go up when they come down this suddenly. But you evidently decided to tell me all, didn't you?

PC: I did. Oh yeah.

LRH: Yeah, you decided to. And that was it. That's – that's very interesting. But you're still thinking about death. What death are you thinking about?

PC: Well, I'm – 1 don't really know. I've got the idea of death more.

LRH: Got the idea of death. Who is it, death of a child?

PC: No, I don't think so, no, a woman.

LRH: Death of a woman.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Bum show? You had some responsibility in it?

PC: Oh, no, not at all.

LRH: Well, the thought of having some responsibility in it produced a reaction here. You didn't have any responsibility? What – what death are you responsible for?

PC: Well, I might have been responsible for this death.

LRH: Hm. Well, let's start this real big, real properly. Is it all right if I run a little scout here on you and look over the situation with an E-Meter?

PC: Yes.

LRH: All right. Okay. Our goal here has already been pretty well achieved but we find a chronic needle bop and I might as well take this needle bop out of the run. And if I take that out, why, maybe we'll get this other – meter reading turned off more or less permanently.

Now, I did tell you to think of death.

PC: Yeah.

LRH: Maybe you remember my doing that?

PC: Yeah.

LRH: Didn't fall out. All right. Now, do you know a death of which you're responsible?

PC: Well, I had some responsibility in a person's death because I was one of the group. That's all.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: That's the only one I'm knowing about.

LRH: That's the one. That one. That cooled it right off.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: That cooled it right off. When was this?

PC: Well, about ten years ago.

LRH: About ten years ago. Mm-hm. That's right. And do you remember when you felt responsible for that?

PC: When I was laying out the body.

LRH: Yeah. Hm. Not until you were ly – laying out the body. You didn't feel responsible for it, but you did then?

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Hm. Little bop here, hardly amount to anything. What other deaths are you – been responsible for?

PC: Well, I was a nurse and…

LRH: Ahhh. Ahhh. Don't – isn't it true you feel a little bit responsible for all of them?

PC: When they died, I did, yes.

LRH: Yeah, when they died, you did.

That-a-girl, now we're getting down to brass tacks. Was there a case of you injecting the wrong anything or – a little sixth sense tells me here there was a case of you deciding that it wasn't the right medicine and you kept your mouth shut. It wasn't the right treatment and you kept your mouth shut and the person did die.

PC: That doesn't come to my mind really. But I did give a patient an overdose of something at one stage but she didn't die.

LRH: But she almost did. Or – made her sicker.

PC: No, she didn't seem to be aware that she had an overdose.

LRH: So, that – that wasn't part of it, huh?

PC: No, I don't – but there were times when I were wishing some of them would die.

LRH: Ah! Bang! Because that would be more merciful.

PC: Yeah.

LRH: All right. You can stop shaking. All right. It's okay. You have wished some of them would die. Is that an overt act?

PC: Oh, I – I did consider it so sometimes after they had died.

LRH: Mm-hm. Hm. Okay, we're cooling this thing off. We're changing its pattern a bit and so on. Just – just name some of those. You know, just…

PC: I knew them mainly as their case.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: I didn't always know their name.

LRH: Well, all right. But just check them off.

PC: There was a young fellow who had disseminated sclerosis and they proceeded to give him morphina in increasing doses.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: And then he died.

LRH: Yeah.

PC: And there was a woman who died of complications of venereal disease.

LRH: Yeah.

PC: And Teppie died of – I never did find out what the trouble was. They just let him die, I think.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: I don't know.

LRH: You're checking them off. A little bit of charge on these, isn't there, huh?

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Just a little bit of charge. Did you feel that your feeling that way about them assisted them to kick off?

PC: No, I don't think I was helping them to live.

LRH: You didn't help them to live?

PC: No.

LRH: Well, when did you decide everybody had to live? Do you remember deciding that?

PC: Well, because I didn't like death really.

LRH: Didn't like death?

PC: Uh-huh.

LRH: But you don't remember deciding something like that, do you?

PC: Yeah.

LRH: Yeah. When?

PC: I can't tell you that, Ron, I don't know. But I've seemed to have had it with me for a while.

LRH: Mm-hm. Well, we've certainly knocked this needle pattern away from what it was anyway.

PC: Yeah.

LRH: See what it's doing now?

PC: I see.

LRH: Now it's checking a little bit of a theta bop, but you notice it's getting a more irregular theta bop. For a while there it was just doing a straight theta bop. That's why I was talking about death just to calm this thing down.

PC: Oh, it was good to look at them. I feel better for looking at them.

LRH: Hm?

PC: I feel better for looking at all these things.

LRH: Oh, yeah. Well, that's swinging around one way or the other.

LRH: Now you're sitting down here pretty square and if – if you thought of something, though, along this line we might get it to go back up. So, let's see if I can get this thing to go up and then come down again. There's a high possibility that we can. What question shouldn't I ask you? That's the one.

PC: You shouldn't ask me about past lives, I've got no really – no reality on them.

LRH: Well, is that an overt act against Scientologists?

PC: Yes, it may be.

LRH: Did you ever think of it that way?

PC: Yes, I – I felt that I couldn't discuss this, not really, because I had no reality on it.

LRH: I see. All right. Good enough. Good enough. That's one of them. All right. Now once more: What question shouldn't I ask you? That's the one.

PC: I don't know what it was.

LRH: All right. There it is. What question shouldn't I ask you?

PC: I don't know of any.

LRH: You don't know of a single one?

PC: No.

LRH: Now you watch this. What question shouldn't I ask you?

PC: That's all right. I don't know what it is.

LRH: Is it about death?

PC: Nope.

LRH: Sex?

PC: No.

LRH: Taarrrrp, boom!

PC: Ah, that's not fair…

LRH: Now I'm not trying to do anything bad here to you. As a matter of fact, trying to help you out.

PC: As a matter of fact that does – does add up because I – I feel there's probably – if there is any past life I should get a reality on, has something to do with a – a sex crime. I felt…

LRH: Ah! I see. I see. That's – well, there's no use asking you if it would be better not to remember that. That would be a stupid question because it's obviously something to do with that.

Do you feel anybody has tried to force past lives on you?

PC: Yes, I do.

LRH: You do. Good. All right, that's my girl now. Who's forced past lives on you? Come on.

PC: Well, we ran a Rock clearing course after an HPA Course.

LRH: Right.

PC: And we were all students together.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: And I just couldn't get this – any reality on this.

LRH: Right.

PC: And the auditor at the time, I felt was…

LRH: You say, "the auditor." Who?

PC: It was a student here.

LRH: Who?

PC: Cable Hill was his name…

LRH: All right.

PC:… is his name.

LRH: Right. Okay.

PC: And I think he – he felt he was onto something and he was trying to get it and I – I did get a bit resentful about it.

LRH: You did, huh.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Now what was your overt against him?

PC: I tried to blow the course. I really took control of the session a few times.

LRH: Mm-hm. Tried to blow session?

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: What did you think of him?

PC: He couldn't control me very well.

LRH: Yeah. All right. Are those your overts on that particular line? Do you consider any of those overts?

PC: Yes, they were.

LRH: Right. Okay. Now what overt have I done to you? What have I done to you here that's bad?

PC: Nothing.

LRH: That's right. Nothing you thought of at all? No? He's caused something there.

PC: I said I've got a twitch in my foot.

LRH: Oh, is that bad?

PC: No, I feel a bit of a shake, that's all.

LRH: Just stop shaking because it's all right. I'll tell you something. I'll let you in on something. You're amongst friends.

PC: I know.

LRH: Isn't that true?

PC: Yeah.

LRH: All right. Now do you think I'm trying to force anything off on you here in any way?

PC: No.

LRH: All right. Now, do you think you are trying to keep me from finding out anything?

PC: Yes, I might be.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: No, I don't think I am, no.

LRH: Yes, calmest needle anybody ever wanted to see here. Life without a little crime, though, isn't well spiced.

PC: I have a bit of time yet.

LRH: Huh?

PC: I've got some time ahead of me yet.

LRH: All right. You've got a little time ahead of you. This thing about past lives does worry you a little bit, huh?

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: It does worry you a tad. Well have you ever heard me say that if it's true, it's true, and if it isn't true, it isn't true?

PC: Yeah.

LRH: Yeah. Well, are you willing to pick and choose amongst that, hm?

PC: Mm-hm. Oh, yes.

LRH: All right. Okay. I never saw anything sitting more solidly on Clear or a more comfortable needle.

PC: Well, I feel all right, too.

LRH: You feel pretty good too. The shakes died down?

PC: Yeah.

LRH: All right. Is it all right with you if we end this scout?

PC: Yes. Thanks, Ron.

LRH: All right. Thank you.

(Applause)

Thank you. Thank you very much. Okay. Well, there was more luck in that than otherwise.

But at least I hope you can get an impression that you can talk to a pc. All right. Did any of you consider there were any Code breaks involved in that? That I evaluated for the pc in any way or something of that sort? Did you – did you think so?

Female voice: I was too interested to notice.

It's a nice fine division toward keeping the pc in comm and talking and so forth, and evaluating for him. You can ask a pc if such and so is the case. But you watch it. A Code break is what the pc considers is a Code break. Do you hear me?

Audience: Yes.

And auditing is what you can get away with.

Female voice: Yes.

Do you understand that?

Audience: Yes.

And you'll find that there are darned few pcs could you get away with the whole gamut of the Auditor's Code. In fact there aren't any.

But as far as evaluation is concerned, you'll get into your worst trouble in the pc supposing the pc has been evaluated for. And sometimes you can say the most innocent things, and if it's an, you know, borderline sort of evaluation – you know, you say, "Oh" you say, "is that because of that sexual incident in high school?" You know. Code break! Code break! Code break!

"Evaluated for me. He's trying to tell me that this thing is bearing on this incident in high school! It's totally in confidence, and has nothing to do with it. And yap, yap, yap, yap, yap, yap." You understand?

Well, you can probe for information up to the point where the pc considers it's a Code break. And if the pc considers it's a Code break you'd certainly better take it apart as a Code break.

And TR 5N requires you to find out what you did in the pc's estimation, and what the pc did. See, the pc did something too. And if you let a pc sit there without getting the pc's overts off the ARC break, of course, the ARC break never cleans up. Got that?

Audience: Yes.

All right. Now, as we look this over we didn't have too successful a run on knocking the needle down because that needle came down magically – bang!

Now, who's got a high needle?

You got a high needle?

Female voice: I think I might have, actually.

Well, come on up and let's see if you've got a high needle. Let's see if they run higher in New Zealand.

LRH: Sit down, Grace.

PC: Thank you.

LRH: You're very courageous to do this, you know, because Hubbard has a reputation of finding out all, and so forth.

Yes, she does as a matter of fact have a little bit of a high needle.

How about you squozen those cans once? That-a-girl. That's fine. Your needle is not what you might call a championship high needle. It's just halfway between male and female Clear. But she should not be reading halfway between, of course, but this is a dangerously high needle, you understand.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Tone arm way up here. Ah, blahhhh! Wooah! You know, pc practically dead. But she's just sitting down here on a little bit of worry mostly because probably she's got some overts against me.

Here.

This charming lady has been treated just a little bit rough – around with appointments and so forth, and it's very nice of her to give a little bit of time on this line.

And here she's busting right on down toward 2.0 too. Must be Hubbard at work.

Okay, is it all right if we run a little bit of a scout here…

PC: Yes.

LRH:… and examine this tone arm?

PC: Yes.

LRH: Okay. Now, we can start this out more formally the way an auditor would.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Do you think you could talk to me freely about…

PC: Yes.

LRH:… about your life?

PC: I think so.

LRH: You think so?

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: About your case?

PC: Yes.

LRH: Good. Ah, about your misdemeanors?

PC: Yes.

LRH: Yes. You think you… She's sitting in a little tiny theta bop. Little tiny theta bop here of one kind or another. I'd say just as a stupid guess that somebody exteriorized you somewhere along the line in auditing or something. Is that right? Just a stupid guess.

PC: Oh, yes, I think I have been exteriorized.

LRH: Yeah!

PC: Mm-hm. Mm-hm.

LRH: All right. You have been exteriorized in auditing.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Do you remember when that was? Yes, sir. There it is.

PC: I seem to get the room.

LRH: You seem to get the room, huh?

PC: Yes, where I was.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: Ah, yes I think it was the first time that I went on a weekend intensive just shortly after I went into Scientology.

LRH: Oh, that-a-girl. And you didn't have an auditor there, did you?

PC: No. No. It was a group.

LRH: Yeah, a group.

PC: Mm.

LRH: And you blew out of your head?

PC: Well something happened. I hit – I hit grief. I saw a face of a baby that had died.

LRH: Oh, yes.

PC: And I don't know what happened after that.

LRH: Mm-hm, kind of went blank?

PC: Yes, so they took me out of the room.

LRH: They took you out of the room?

PC: Yes.

LRH: Oh, all right.

PC: And – yes, I remember who the auditor was now that took me out of the room and sorted it out.

LRH: You remember who it was?

PC: Yes, it was a Keith Parker in New Zealand.

LRH: All right. But remember they took you out of the room, didn't they?

PC: Yes, because I'd broken into grief.

LRH: Well, that's-was that an exteriorization?

PC: Ah, yes.

LRH: All right.

PC: You didn't mean that sort, though, did you?

LRH: Well, no, I was just – I was just gagging.

PC: Yes.

LRH: I just thought you might have confused the two.

PC: Hm.

LRH: [to audience] Now, you understand why I picked on that, by the way, is because it was just a little tiny theta bop and it was inexplicable and seemed to have been turned on the moment that somebody started to audit her. So, I kind of said, "Well, I don't know, take a wild guess, you know, that's all, just a wild guess, look in the pc's head and see what it is."

[to pc] Very good. Well, that's kind of cleaned that a little bit, but I see you still hanging on to your tone arm reading here.

What do you – anything else you'd like to say about that, Grace?

PC: About that…

LRH: Yeah.

PC:… incident?

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: Well, I'm – I feel I'm aberrated on sex…

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC:… and child and…

LRH: Yeah.

PC:… losing this baby…

LRH: Yeah.

PC:… and responsibility for losing it.

LRH: Yeah.

PC: Melbourne means something to me. Since I've been here I've had a lot of somatics.

LRH: You have, huh?

PC: I was here twenty-one years ago and… Oh! That's when I exteriorized!

LRH: Oh!

PC: Ah, yes.

LRH: All right.

PC: Yes, that's right!

LRH: All right, what happened?

PC: It was in Melbourne.

LRH: Yeah.

PC: In the hospital out here. I got pneumonia…

LRH: Yeah?

PC:… and I – I was…

LRH: Right.

PC:… I was exteriorized then.

LRH: Okay.

PC: And then the nurse came along and put oxygen up my nose and, well, I guess I went back into the body.

LRH: No kidding.

PC: Yes.

LRH: Well, all right, very good. And that's – that's – that was the end of that bop. Well, all right. All right. Is it a different Melbourne today?

PC: Yes, it is.

LRH: All right.

PC: Yes.

LRH: All right.

[to audience] And we lost, by the way, the second we got that recovered. This actually is not a very classic demonstration because I'm not dragging any information out of people. This thing you'll notice now is sitting only a quarter up from female Clear to male. See.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: It backed off just that much in what little she has told me right up to this time. [to pc] It's all right if I make side comments?

PC: Oh, yes, it's quite all right.

LRH: See, it's backed off that much, see. It's getting right on down to there. See how it sits?

Audience: Mm-hm.

LRH: Well, good enough. Did you have a rough time seeing me?

PC: When I've seen you it wasn't rough.

LRH: All right.

PC: Waiting for you was.

LRH: Well, waiting for me was. Was that an overt on my part?

PC: Oh, I don't know about that.

LRH: No. All right. Was it an overt anywhere on your part?

PC: I did think, well, it doesn't matter if I don't see Ron after I'd seen you lecture.

LRH: Oh, I see, was that an overt in some fashion?

PC: Don't think so.

LRH: Yeah, all right.

PC: And then I wondered perhaps if you didn't want to see me.

LRH: Yeah. All right.

PC: I have had those thoughts.

LRH: Okay.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Well, that's pretty smooth and clean. You can see for yourself it's not diving on any of that.

PC: No, that's good.

LRH: All right. Do you mind if I make a comment?

PC: No. Not at all.

LRH: Most auditors you know, they're riding in mystery, you know.

The reason you don't let a pc watch the meter when you're looking for a time or looking for charge or something like that is the pc starts putting his or her attention on the needle, you see, not on their case. And the needle stops reading. That's all. It stops reading anything. But they're running a contest with the meter. They see the meter going up so they try to think, "Well, I don't know. Should it go up, should it go down?" and so on.

It doesn't do any harm to show a pc what the meter says.

Well, good enough. Now these somatics drop out about Melbourne now?

PC: Oh yes. Yes!

LRH: Well, all right.

PC: Yes.

LRH: Okay.

PC: Yes.

LRH: Good enough. Good enough. Now what – what question, Grace, what question shouldn't I ask you? That's the one.

PC: When am I going on an ACC.

LRH: Oh, all right.

PC: That's what I thought of.

LRH: All right. When are you going on an ACC?

PC: Oh, it depends on my husband.

LRH: I see. Is that a rough one?

PC: Oh, he's here.

LRH: Huh?

PC: He's a rough one sometimes.

LRH: Is he here?

PC: Yes, he's here.

LRH: Yeah, he's here. Let's give him a bad time. Well now does your husband beat you much?

PC: I don't think… I'm more liable to beat him.

LRH: Yeah, yeah, that was just a joke. Okay. Now, is that a serious question to you? Why shouldn't I ask you that question?

PC: Oh, I think I could have made more effort to get on an ACC.

LRH: Mm.

PC: Mm.

LRH: Mm-hm. You think you kind of let it coast or something of the sort?

PC: Mm, I did.

LRH: Mm.

PC: Hm. I did put it up as a sort of a goal and then I put it away again, you know.

LRH: Mm.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Hm. Well now, what failure in your life would be so marked as to cause you to go on the cycle of deciding it would be very nice and trying to do it and then deciding it didn't matter?

PC: It's just sort of blank.

LRH: Baby?

PC: Oh, yes! Yes! That's right. Boy, you're clever.

LRH: All right.

PC: That's right. Yes. Yes.

LRH: Is that right?

PC: That's right. Uh-huh.

LRH: Been kind of riding along like that?

PC: Mm-hm. Years, oh yes. See, we lost this baby and then we couldn't seem to get a baby ourselves so we adopted a baby.

LRH: Yeah.

PC: And got one little girl, and then we thought about – of adopting another one.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: And well, we've still just got the one little girl.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: And I have been sort of in the maybes – oh yes, I should; yes, I shouldn't, you know.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: And it's been like that for a few years.

LRH: What would you call – do you think that it was your fault that you lost that first baby?

PC: Yes, I do now.

LRH: You do now?

PC: Mm-hm. Yes.

LRH: Anybody tell you it was?

PC: No. No, I found that out in processing.

LRH: How'd you find it out in processing?

PC: Through looking at my overts.

LRH: Yeah.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Mm-hm. What do you think about babies?

PC: Well, I think they're nice but then I think they can be a damned nuisance too.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: All right.

PC: I've got a sort of a two-sided thing on them.

LRH: Uh-huh. You're rather whumped on the subject then?

PC: Um, not entirely but I don't think I'm – I think I'm aberrated.

LRH: You think you're aberrated on it?

PC: Mm.

LRH: You'd feel better if you got this one out of the road, do you think?

PC: Oh, yeah, that would be real nice.

LRH: Oh, good. All right. All right. Now, did you ever know anybody that felt this way about babies beside yourself?

PC: Well, I thought of my sister then…

LRH: Your sister?

PC: Yeah, much the same sort of case.

LRH: Yeah.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Yeah. Well, your sister – she was raised by who?

PC: My mother.

LRH: Yeah, well what about your mother on the subject of babies? Let's get down to brass tacks here a little bit.

PC: My mother. Well, Mother didn't tell me the facts of life. I mean, I…

LRH: Didn't?

PC: No.

LRH: No. Is that a – all right.

PC: I was quite a girl in my teens really. I sort of didn't know much about…

Mm-hm.

PC: … that life and sort of got involved, you know.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: Unwillingly.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: Really.

LRH: All right.

PC: What else do you want to know?

LRH: Didn't tell you the facts of life and you got involved?

PC: Yes, I sort of got involved.

LRH: Yes. All right.

PC: Hm.

LRH: Go on. Was that an overt act against your mother?

PC: Oh, well it could have been.

LRH: It could be?

PC: Yes, it could be, Mum wouldn't really expect me to get involved in any way…

LRH: Mm-hm. How about…

PC: … with sex.

LRH: How about yourself. Was it an overt act against yourself?

PC: I don't know.

LRH: All right. How about the boy involved, if there was one?

PC: Oh, yes, yes.

LRH: It was an overt act against the boy?

PC: Yes.

LRH: You think so.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: All right. Okay. How do you feel about that?

PC: Oh, I don't mind much now. I've sort of had a look at it.

LRH: Yeah.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: You still lost a sixteenth of a mark on the tone arm. Okay.

PC: Um.

LRH: Down there another sixteenth, see. Picking these little – little charges off the line and that looks very interesting to me. You – if you'd been informed you would have done a better…

PC: I would have, but I don't know whether my bank would have.

LRH: Ah. All right.

LRH: Now, did you – did you mind mentioning this or my mentioning this to the people?

PC: No. No, I don't mind.

LRH: You've gotten over that, haven't you?

PC: Yes.

LRH: Yes, indeed you have. All right.

LRH: Now would you call that a discreditable – that original misadventure, would you have called that a discreditable creation?

PC: Yes, I would have.

LRH: Yes.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Yes, yes. And how about the baby that died, would you call that discreditable?

PC: No, I think that was a real failure.

LRH: Hm.

PC: Hm, I can hit grief on that one still.

LRH: Mm-hm, right, right. Does it trace back in any way to the earlier incident?

PC: No, I don't think so. It seems to go back further on the track.

LRH: Where to?

PC: Oh, something to do with a baby in a dustbin or…

LRH: Hm.

PC: … or burying a baby, a newborn baby.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: Abortion…

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: … either being an abortionist myself…

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: … or – these are all bits I've looked at on the track…

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: … in processing.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: Victim actually. Then, there also seems to be one further back than that where there was a tribe of women.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: Women ruled and they – they worshipped a stone penis.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: And I seem to have something to do with that and go off and get men and use them – make them work and use them in every way we wanted to. I've looked at all these bits and pieces. And I haven't sort of followed anything right through on them.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: But there seems to be… Incidentally when my Rock was scouted out it was a cone.

LRH: Yeah.

PC: Mm. And I don't know whether that's got anything to do with it or not.

LRH: All right. Okay. Well now, looking this over, we asked you a question there: Who would you say that you've known in this lifetime now…

PC: Mm.

LRH:… that would have reacted this way toward babies and children and so forth? You know anybody that would have reacted this way?

PC: I immediately think of my sister.

LRH: You think it's your sister?

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: All right. Not your mother?

PC: Mother would have been like that, I should think.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: I've always had a feeling that Mother had to get married. I don't know why.

LRH: Oh, yes.

PC: I don't know whether she did or not. But I've had that feeling she had to get married.

LRH: All right. Okay.

PC: I hope she's not listening.

LRH: Well is there any… Now, what's that fall on? Mother might be listening. Yes. There is a nice steep fall. Hm! You withholding something from Mother?

PC: Well I'm withholding my presence at the present time but…

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC:… in the way of information?

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: Not that I know of.

LRH: All right. Good enough. Good enough. You think it might be your sister, huh, that feels like that? How about…

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: How about some other female relative?

PC: I get no woman – no – no relative.

LRH: All right, how about a man?

PC: Well, I've got a cousin who showed me his penis.

LRH: Oh, all right, okay.

PC: When I was a kid. He said, "Well, I've got this."

LRH: There we are, there's a nice fall. Okay. You know, Freudianwise that would have ruined your life. You realize that?

PC: Yes.

LRH: How do you feel about that now?

PC: Well, that's okay.

LRH: All right.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Okay. Now, in just looking around here, is there anything else I shouldn't ask you about?

LRH: There's something.

PC: I didn't catch what it was.

LRH: All right. What shouldn't I ask you?

PC: Oh, you shouldn't ask me to audit you.

LRH: All right, that was what it was. Okay.

PC: It was about auditing.

LRH: All right. It was about auditing?

PC: Yes. Yes. Mm-hm.

LRH: All right. Well, is there any other question I shouldn't ask you about auditing? Yes. Come on. What is it?

PC: Oh, well, it's probably got to do with HASI Auckland.

LRH: About what?

PC: About HASI Auckland.

LRH: Oh, yes, well what about auditing HASI Auckland?

PC: Well, I don't know. I just wouldn't like you to question me too much, that's all, about HASI Auckland.

LRH: You just wouldn't, huh?

PC: That's the feeling I got here.

LRH: Yeah, that's what it says here. That's what it says here.

PC: Yes.

LRH: That's fine.

PC: Hm.

LRH: Now, who would that louse up?

PC: Oh, people.

LRH: People. Ah, yes. Oh boy!

[to audience] We're getting a fall here. There was something the pc was unwilling to tell the auditor and that accounts for that last eighth.

[to pc] All right. Now what are you coughing about?

PC: I know what it is. I had twenty-five hours run on "From where could you communicate to a chest" and it was flat and – and – of course since I've come to Melbourne I've been coughing something dreadful and I got this chest somatic.

LRH: I see. Well, what did you have out here in the hospital?

PC: Pneumonia. Hm. That's right. I sort of knew that, you know. I knew that I was on a much higher level, at least I wasn't going to get pneumonia this time.

LRH: Yeah, all right. Now, I'm not being accusative along the line. I just couldn't…

PC: Hm.

LRH:… help but ask you that question.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Was that all right?

PC: That was quite all right. Mm-hm.

LRH: All right. And we've got about a thirty-second of a tone to go.

LRH: Okay. I don't imagine you're a very difficult pc. I imagine you run very well, don't you?

PC: I have got that reputation.

LRH: Right.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Right. But let me ask you once more, what else – what other question shouldn't I ask you?

LRH: There it is.

PC: But I didn't grab it, I didn't – didn't see what it was.

LRH: Some question I shouldn't ask you here, it says. Is it still about…?

PC: I should think it would be about HASI.

LRH: It is about HASI and so forth.

PC: Hm.

LRH: Ah.

PC: Because I would like you to come.

LRH: Uh-huh. It looks awful cooled off about now.

PC: I guess it is now…

LRH: Is it or isn't it? Is it or isn't it?

PC: No. I'd be quite prepared to tell you anything.

LRH: Yeah, all right. All right. That's what it says.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Okay, all right. You don't feel that you're protecting then numerous people about being revealed in horrible crimes then?

PC: Oh, no, I don't think that.

LRH: No, no. Ah, dear, that upset you that I asked you that question?

PC: It did a little.

LRH: Yeah.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Good, now, why did that upset you? Come on.

PC: Hm, oh, just on account of something that was said. But I don't want to talk about it here.

LRH: Yeah, that-that's right. That's what it says.

PC: Ooh!

LRH: Well, somebody say I was a tramp and a bum and should be shot? Is that the…

PC: No.

LRH:…size of it?

PC: It was just implications about HASI Auckland which I resented very much. And that's about it.

LRH: Is that about it?

PC: Yeah. Yeah, that's it.

LRH: Well, that's awful cruised off here. There doesn't seem to – that's cooling it off some more. What did you do out of your resentment?

PC: Well, I sort of thought about things myself. I just was sort of interiorized into myself about it.

LRH: Hm.

PC: And got into a confusion.

LRH: Mm-hm. Mm-hm.

PC: I struck the maybes.

LRH: Mm-hm.

PC: I've still got a lot of little maybes on it.

LRH: Sure?

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Sure?

PC: Mm-hm, but I'll find out.

LRH: You'll find out.

PC: Yeah, I'll find out.

LRH: Well, who will you find out about?

PC: All the people concerned in it.

LRH: All right. Now, who were the people concerned in it?

PC: Well, there's – there would be the terminals in Auckland.

LRH: Right.

PC: Um.

LRH: And what are they – who are they?

PC: There would be Frank.

LRH: Right.

PC: And Betty.

LRH: Right.

PC: And Steve.

LRH: Right.

PC: And there'd be some here…

LRH: Right.

PC:… in HASI here.

LRH: Right.

PC: Um.

LRH: Right.

PC: That's about all.

LRH: That's about all?

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Okay. And do you think you'll find out about this sooner or later?

PC: Oh, sooner or later I will.

LRH: Sooner or later you will.

PC: Yes, I'll understand it.

LRH: Well, is it discreditable of you to try to find out?

PC: Oh no, I think it's real good of me.

LRH: All right.

PC: For me it is. I've got to find out for me.

LRH: All right. You've got to find out for you.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: That's exactly right.

PC: Mm-hm.

LRH: Have you been worried about this?

PC: Yes, very.

LRH: Have you been worried that I might ask you about this?

PC: Yes.

LRH: Have you been worried that I might find out something about this?

PC: Well, I would like you to find out about it if there's anything there to find out about.

LRH: All right. Okay. Okay.

[to audience] She's sitting on female Clear.

[to pc] Okay, well is it all right with you if we call that scout ended, hm?

PC: Yes, Ron.

LRH: Anything else you'd like to say about this little scout here, hm?

PC: I think it's been wonderful.

LRH: All right, well thank you very much. And it was very – very nice of you to come up here and expose your psyche to view and so forth.

PC: Thank you for helping me.

LRH: Yeah, but I think-I think it's a mighty – mighty clean, well-washed psyche. I think it's in good shape.

PC: I hope so.

LRH: You betcha. Thanks a lot, Grace.

PC: Thank you.

LRH: Okay. Step down.

(Applause)

Well, that's the extent of our demonstration. Anybody want to ask me any questions about all this?

Come on, come on, come on, come on, don't be so bashful, would you?

Male voice: Ron, can you tell us the value of doing that, the relative importance of doing that to begin the session?

Are you asking so I'll tell them?

Male voice: No, I'm asking…

You asking because you want to know?

Male voice: Yeah. In other words, you've got a hot process that's running on a pc that…

You've got a hot process running on a pc, you start monkeying around with the session you ought to be shot.

Now, listen. All right, now – now state your question again Peter.

Male voice: What is the relative worth of doing this before running a session given that you've got a process, not necessarily that you've run, but it looks like it's – but the pc's, got a – say a 4.0 or 5.0 tone arm?

All right. Let's take a look at this. How much auditing have you had?

Female voice: Me?

Yeah.

Female voice: About – probably about seventy-five hours of auditing or more.

All right, how much auditing have you had, Betty?

Female voice: Well, I've had a few thousand now.

And where were – these cases reputedly… One was sitting on 4.0 and the other one was sitting on for sure 3 and a half.

There was something along the line that was restraining the case from going completely into session in each case. I think both – they both could tell you this. See, something, no matter how undefined, something that wasn't quite free or clean or clear with the auditor, you might say or with the auditor's behavior or whether or not the case had confidence in the auditor. This had to do a lot with confidence probably or something like this. These are indefinable, practically, items.

All I'm telling you is the technical fact that you could probably audit a case sitting at 5.0 that isn't totally freely discussing things, and isn't totally freely visible to the rest of the world for several thousand hours without reducing it down below 5.0. Do you get me?

Audience: Mm-hm.

Get me?

Isn't that interesting?

Audience: Mm-hm.

Hm? You get the-what I'm talking about?

Now, therefore we were establishing a communication factor. And all I'm trying to show you is that with just establishment of a free communication with the preclear, can establish a Clear reading for the tone arm. And that's the total of this demonstration.

Now, the significance of that will become very visible. If I tell you at the same time that failure to establish two-way communication and free sessioning with the preclear – I have seen a preclear personally run fifteen hundred hours at 5 and a half with no real reduction but occasional fluctuations down to 3.0 and 2.0 and then right back up again because two-way comm was never established with the pc by anybody anywhere. You follow this?

Audience: Yes.

You'll find there's a part of the Auditor's Code says, "stay in two-way comm with the pc," doesn't it, huh?

Audience: Mm-hm.

Well, then, I will tell you directly that running a pc with a high tone arm is a break of the Auditor's Code! You got that?

Now I won't tell that to an HPA, but I'll tell you that: that running a pc with a consistently high tone arm is a break of the Auditor's Code because two-way comm has not been established. Do you follow that?

Audience: Yes.

And you sit there and you say to the pc, "Well, is it all right if we audit you, if I audit you and so forth, and na-thuh-ta-thuh. That's fine. I don't see any – I don't see anything thuh-ta-thuh."

"No, there isn't anything I have to tell you. No, I'm willing to tell you anything." And the pc is sitting at 5.0 or a girl is sitting at 4.0.

It's a break of the Auditor's Code because no session has been established – interested in own case and so forth.

Now, a pc has visible known data which separates the pc from the rest of the human race. And when the pc feels that he or she is separated from the rest of the human race you get a high tone arm. And if that pc feels very separated from the human race, and can't be talked to, can't be talked about, can't freely discuss things with the rest of the human race, they can't be audited.

But an auditor, by establishing two-way comm, as you have seen me do today – and this maybe – to some of you, did this look too clever to be done?

Audience: No.

It didn't, did it?

Audience: No.

Looked fairly simple, didn't it?

Audience: Yes.

You see me in there pitching because of what I know about cases, mainly – I mean I just know that cases go this way. I see a theta bop and I know they've blown out of their heads someplace. You get used to that sort of thing.

All it means is that a pc to clear up and become clear by this demonstration – what you saw me doing here has to be clear before they're cleared, doesn't it?

Audience: Yes.

Well, that's right. Well, let's do it folks, let's do it. Simple, huh?

And don't you let me catch you sitting around let – waiting for a process to reduce a tone arm. Not when you've been through this class.

How do you reduce a tone arm?

Audience: Two-way comm.

Establish two-way comm with a pc. That's it. You've learned your lesson.

Good night.

DEMO OF KNOCKING DOWN A TONE ARM PAGE 28 1MACC-04 - 10.11.59

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