View source for Q and A Period; Tiger Drilling, Clears (SHSBC 621122)

'''Series:''' Saint Hill Special Briefing Course (SHSBC)

'''Date:''' 22 November 1962

'''Speaker:''' L. Ron Hubbard

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Okay. Here we have the second Saint Hill Briefing Course lecture of November the 22nd, AD 12. Now, our question period progresses and continues.

Okay. I've got a question here which is – I don't dig. Oh!

It's a question, “Has some – has somebody been terminated or retained?” That is to say the fact of termination. This person is mixed up about the co-audit. The co-audit has ceased to exist.

Termination is simply just termination. There is no further co-audit after termination as far as the course is concerned. You want to sit down up in East Grinstead or something like that and drop around once in a while it's perfectly all right with us.

But as far as termination is concerned, that is just termination. Now, as far as auditing a pc outside, there was an offer there to the December 1st and so forth. Well, by all means hang around until December the 1st if you're not assigned classes or anything.

But this doesn't constitute a co-audit. Termination's a termination. It means we have no further responsibility for your training and that I demand exclusively that you now operate.

The termination says you are now an auditor. And here's, “When do I think this auditor's District Office would be likely to materialize officially?” Well, this whole question of a District Office, the Scientology 1970 should not be understood as first we redesign HCO WW and then we redesign Continental Offices and then we redesign city offices, and eventually get around to building up District Offices. The District Office has yet to evolve.

There are no orders at this moment as what a District Office is supposed to do or what it constitutes. There has only been a thought of what it might be. The person operating a District Office might take off in numerous lines.

Might do numerous things. I notice that Melbourne was a bit mixed up on their clearing co-audit which  Q & A PERIOD: 2  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS is also a health co-audit which will also make you live longer and it's all on the same HAS Co-audit. See?

Well, I would say a District Office shouldn't do that. See, that's four things that are combined into one activity. And that's hoping that everybody will come in on the same activity and go out the same way, you see?

Actually, it's not designed that way. If you're going to run a clearing co-audit as a District Office, well, run a clearing co-audit as a District Office. But nobody in your district or area has heard of clearing – you can't seem to get anybody very interested in clearing – you've got a health co-audit, don't you see?

You've got a springboard that you can take off from. But for a District Office that is now operating as a private practice – a fellow in private practice wants to go over into a District Office. What do we do?

Cut off his head and make him totally insolvent? And say that he must take on no private pcs forevermore and that he can only run a clearing co-audit? But he hasn't any candidates for a clearing co-audit.

He hasn't built anything up. Now, these things are not done with great suddenness and exclamation points. These things are evolved.

We have yet to find out stably how can a District Office best survive? I know a lot about this because I know what made the Dublin office survive and not survive – and it came very close to being a District Office. It was little or no private processing – it was all group activity of one kind or another and if it had gone along and had good leadership along the line after I left it – it would have been very, very successful.

Had quite a bit of experience with this kind of an activity, but these things come down to economics. And before there are shifts, we've got to pioneer this action. Now, we have some things called District Offices.

But there is nothing specified as to what they do. What is specified is that they are part of Scientology – that they are a regular Scientology office – various other conditions could be made concerning this, and have been made concerning their legality – part of the administrative framework. That sort of thing.

But exactly how do they give service? Well, that has got to be evolved. And you see that it'd be folly for me to say that they give service in just exactly this way, this way and this way whereas the matter of the data at hand is so slim that one couldn't say this.

So maybe one District Office is a little sort of an HGC and another District Office is a co-audit for health addicts – and another one, they get a lot of things going on the subject of clearing, don't you see? And they gradually get their feet off the ground. Now, anybody in his district or area at this particular time has some income line or some flowing line on the subject of Scientology.

There's already some action taking place in that immediate area. Well, the question is to build that action and evolve that action, as a District Office. And you'll wind up with a very strong District Office.

But you're not going to kill off the interest, the enthusiasm in various lines – then put in an arbitrary thing and try to smash people's enthusiasm into that – because it never smashes. It just smashes. You can't  Q & A PERIOD: 3  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS detour this enthusiasm – you can – you can gradually shepherd it.

You can do other things with it. Let's say we have twenty people in Riverside who are very, very interested in their auditor coming back from Saint Hill. So we say to this fellow, “All right, you're a District Office.

You're going to be a District Office.” And fine, he says, “Swell.” That's good with him. He never particularly liked the franchise setup and it's left him in a great deal of – with no financial resources or anything like that. So he's going to be a District Office.

All right. Now he goes back into this district or this area. He's got twenty people.

Well, he's certainly going to have to talk it over with these twenty people what they're going to do. And then his District Office does what they're going to do. Get the idea?

That's the criteria on which you build it. Now, when District Offices are straightened out and all of that is very smooth – then we'll start putting together city offices to take care of that service sphere and then we'll put together the other offices to take care of the lower offices. You cannot build a house by laying in the roof tree first.

It just can't be done. So any question about a District Office – yes, we intended every auditor's activity anyplace should be a District Office. What is the activity of a District Office?

It is what they make it. What service does a District Office get? It's what they've got to be given.

You get this? And that way we'll build a strong structure from the bottom up. And the services that are given will be real and the people who will be supporting it and doing it will be real and their interest and service they'll consider real, don't you see?

Now, if I were going to set up a District Office – this is a different proposition, see? If I myself were going to set up a District Office – and I'm just an auditor now and I can clear people or run co-audits and I've had experience in this various lines – I'd probably go rent a store. I probably wouldn't take the front room of my house.

I'd probably go rent a store, an old empty store someplace or another. They're wide – pardon me, they're narrow and deep. You can put auditing room partitions in the back of them, you can put book displays in the front of them, you can make them look good, you can curtain off an area just inside the door from the street.

You've got a big room there you can set up two lines of chairs in and people can do co-auditing. In other words, this is fine. And it also gives you street visualness.

And you put up a proper book display and some other displays in the window that says what you're doing and that sort of thing. And then I'd go into it hammer-pound and I would pick up – I would send out a great many feelers. I would get some lines going out of one kind or another.

And I'd see which one of those lines responded. And that one I would hit hard and then I'd build it. I'd build it from there.

And I wouldn't change it as long as that line was successful. I would just keep it building. I wouldn't split or disperse my interest.

See, all of a sudden to find that all the high schools in the vicinity are so juvenile delinquented that they don't know whether they're  Q & A PERIOD: 4  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS coming or going. Then I find that everybody's terribly interested in this. Everybody's fascinated with this.

Everybody listens to it. Find out they understand what I say on the subject. Well, I don't run this District Office, then, day and night, on this subject and that subject and another subject and another subject and another subject and ...

No, I'd just reach out and I'd grab three hundred and eighty-five high school students and I start them through the thing, man. And as far as persuading the student – high school students to go through it, well, I'd – that's fine. But I also persuade other people to make them go through it.

You get the idea? And I arrange for certain set charges and they all come in and they co-audit and they gradually get so they can see the wall, you know? And everybody'd be very happy with me.

I'd go around to parent-teacher's meetings every now and then – get three or four auditors to help me – HPA, HCA level auditors to help me. Knock their heads in if they don't give proper technical supervision. Don't let anything get weird on the subject.

There's certain fellows there that have to have a certain amount of help, which is individualized help. They're much too tough – they can't even sit in the chair, you know? Well, I'd pray to have a city office running an HGC to turn them over to.

Because frankly, I would not have time to do it. I mean, that is about the way I would go in along the line. But it's a matter of feeling your way.

And developing what you find. And not staying on a big dispersal – and hitting every line all over the place. Because you start following an interest line in the society, it actually requires all of your interest, all of your attention, to keep that one line going.

And you can keep it going very, very well. In Ireland, oddly enough, what happened to the office is quite interesting. It's – because it happened to it after I left there.

It was quite solvent and everything was fine till I left there. The idea got home that longshoremen were not quite nice. I was developing a land office business in longshoremen.

These were tough mugs. It was quite remarkable. These characters were coming in and somebody disagree with the Instructor or something like that – well, their full answer was to throw him out, bodily, see?

They didn't even talk good English. They weren't educated, you know? They probably sweated a bit, you know, down on the docks.

That was developing at a high roar. These characters and their union and everybody else was getting very interested in this, you know? And it was a matter of, “Well, Tim, I think you ought to go down there tonight, since I'm not – Tim?” He'd be down there that night.

These guys were very solidly behind us. And the people – not necessarily the people that followed me there – but some of the people who were there decided this was not quite nice. And they got in some intellectual louses who were very intellectual.

And in spite of my telling everybody that an intellectual is defined as somebody who thinks about things – and  Q & A PERIOD: 5  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS we didn't want anybody thinking about anything – we wanted people doing things. And these longshoremen were absolutely ideal. But the next thing you know, why, these crude characters and types were being discouraged and so on – and then there were other little nasty things like this fellow wasn't quite nice because he was a member of the IRA – and this other fellow wasn't quite socially acceptable, you see, because, because, because.

And next thing you know they didn't have a solvent office. Now, the only thing that happened there is I found this track in the society. I found this zone of interest.

And I was busy driving this thing home. Think of it. If every longshoreman in Ireland had gotten very interested in this and that had gone over into the drivers and teamsters and think – and taxicab drivers and this birds and that birds and the other birds and – and if it had hit there at the doingness strata of the society, think of what would have been the final result of all this.

Instead of that we finally wound up with fifteen or twenty people sitting around talking about it. And I thought it was awfully sweet, and we closed the office. I was no longer there.

I'd been gone for ages. But that was an interesting thing. You have to look into the society and find a track – find a place where you can drive something through, you see?

And then you don't keep hammering around at other places where you can't drive something through – you keep adding up all of your hammer blows on that one track, if you're dealing in a small area. And when you finished it up, man, you've got a hole driven through all of the results, all of the objections of this and that, you see? And the only times I've ever seen Scientology on a dissemination pattern fold up is when a specialized proven line was not forwarded.

And I've seen something come off of that. I've seen time split up. I have seen something else happen in that area that shouldn't have happened, see?

A dispersal of interest, a dispersal of activity – and then it failed. So that's the criteria, actually. That's all I can almost – all I can tell you about a District Office, see.

Who's to man the District Office? Well, the people that man the District Office are people necessary to take care of the business of the District Office. What is the business of the District Office?

Well, it's that business which best disseminates in that particular area for that particular office. Now, you ask me what and I say at once, well, there it is. And who should run a District Office, who gets a District Office?

That's very interesting. What do you get for getting a District Office? Well, I got the answer to that one the other day.

We've now got several District Offices. They were fairly successful franchise offices. And, let me tell you this.

A person who has been a party to or has formed up a District Office has now this: He has the rights to that post or position in a District Office. You think that over for a moment. That's quite revolutionary.

That's quite revolutionary, if you think it over. He has a right to a District Office or that equivalent post in the District Office. Q & A PERIOD: 6  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS Let's say somebody was a Receptionist in a District Office and it built up to a very successful District Office while that person was there.

All right, what are the rights of that person in that District Office? Well, they're the rights to be a Receptionist in a District Office. Now, what does this take care of?

This takes care of the people moving from – well, somebody gets awfully tired of lower South Amboy and they want to go to lower Chicago. And, all right. What do they do, just give up any rights to anything that they have built or constructed or something.?

No, it's up to the organization to give them an equivalent spot in a District Office. That's what they own – that's their right, don't you see? They've earned that right.

They have a right to one such spot, don't you see? Now let's say somebody went in there and hammer and pound and so forth and he was head of a District Office and so forth. He'll always be head of a District Office.

If he got made a successful District Office, he always has a District Office. All right, he wants to go to lower Chicago, and nobody in lower Chicago has built anything up, there isn't anything in lower Chicago and so forth. Well, obviously the organization would have to finance – well, it was agreed that lower Chicago was a good place to put it in – the organization would have to finance him a District Office in lower Chicago.

They would appoint, however – and this is what covers the one point where we've been missing on dissemination – and believe me, this is the only point we've really been missing on dissemination – lower South Amboy is not suddenly without a District Office just because this fellow wanted to go to lower Chicago. And that's our biggest point of failure. Auditor pulling up stakes and going someplace else and he doesn't have anybody to turn his group or his connections or anything else over to, and listen – when that happens, I hear from people or I don't hear from people, and they're usually all ARC broke.

And somebody spent – we spend a lot of our time individually building up some particular area and then, very often, just go off and leave it. And it collapses and nothing picks it up. The District Office is basically an idea formed – that after an interest and so forth has been built up in an area that it will be continued in that area without nailing that auditor down in that area.

Because auditors are shifty-footed – they go places. And so all right, so he's built a District Office. It must have an address and it must have this and it must have that and must have the other thing, naturally – always does.

Structure of activity. And this person, this person isn't going to stay in Riverside forever. Well, all right, so he gets in touch with his next immediate area – you see every District Office doesn't necessarily have a city office over it.

He gets in touch with his next contact up the line and he says, “I'm leaving Riverside. I want to leave Riverside. And I want to be out of here by the first of November.” They're going to have to find somebody in Riverside, that's all.

They're going to have to put somebody down in Riverside. You see how that would work out? Therefore, that territory which has been conquered stays conquered.

You're not always abandoning territory. I mean, the amount of work which auditors have done to straighten out  Q & A PERIOD: 7  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS or fix up various areas in the world, it'd break your heart. Because when they move on, when they change interest, when they do this or that – then that area and zone collapses and that ceases to be conquered territory, and it's quite interesting.

So the District Office is basically a design which will not nail the auditor down in one spot for the rest of his life and which continues that area as a going concern. And that's what it's all about. Financing and that sort of thing is a delicate point.

It's sometimes hard to take care of It's got to be done on a give-and-take proposition. The amount of money which can be made by a District Office is basically made by the developed patterns of approach to people. I learned an awful lot about this in Ireland – I really did, in Dublin.

It was quite amazing. I had a ball over there. I figured if you could put one together in Ireland you could put one together in hell.

Let me tell you man, that's marvelous! I mean, that's – that's fantastic. You had groups of people who could not define or encompass create.

They could not define it or encompass it – couldn't talk about it, couldn't agree or admit that it existed. How do you like this? Fabulous!

Blow your brains out. They had people at work who were all the time telling them it was against the church for them to come down to that particular horrible place. They were running up and down the streets with placards. “We have never heard of those people across the street,” see?

And they were making a big noise about it, you know? Oh yeah, had everything you could think of against us. And we still climbed the hill.

And I thought, “If you can do it here, you can do it anyplace.” Hope that answers some of your questions on it. Didn't mean to get too lengthy on it. “Please, will you let us have suggestions for handling co-audit listing. Would an amplifying system with earphones, each audit coupled with a panel meter control be practiced and so forth?” Very burning question.

A very, very interesting question. And it's asked directly and immediately in the middle of the development on the answers to it. I hate to see you nailed down with that much electronic gear.

See? By the time somebody sits down in the seat he looks like an astronaut, you know? I just don't think it should be that complicated.

But what I'm trying to do – what I'm trying to do is, at the expense of it being much longer and taking much longer – develop a clearing technique that could be run very, very solidly in a co-audit by just maybe two or three repetitive commands. I know one right now that would probably do it in three commands. Same as the old HAS Co-audit.

You write the commands up on the blackboard and if the – if the pc says something or does something the auditor frightenedly puts out his hand to the back of the chair and an Instructor goes up and handles it, you know? That kind of an action. He's just supposed to say these three things.

And I don't envision any listing on written pages in a co-audit. You're rapidly breaking down certain percentages of pcs. Rapidly breaking it down here into what types and kinds of pcs there are, and so on.

Well, they're all the same kind of pc, but some of them list easier than  Q & A PERIOD: 8  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS others and some of them this way and some of them that way, don't you see? And there's about 25 or 30 percent of the pcs have no business on a co-audit, a clearing co-audit, see. They would just fumble and dumble.

Well, I'm trying to hit at that level of case for the tests I'm making on these three commands. And I'm trying to handle the toughest case that you could get, to handle it. Now, we wouldn't have a clue as to how many years this fellow was on a co-audit before he went Clear.

We just have a guarantee of progress. Now, the main – the main thing we're after in a co-audit then – the direction we're trying to take – is a repetitive command basis which is relatively unsupervised. That is to say, as far as listening directly and immediately through meters and earphones is concerned.

The remedy is policing the co-audit as it occurs. Auditors – HPAs and so forth – are quite successful in doing this. I like the way they handle this sort of thing.

They do it well. They get a number of raw meat pcs lined up in the pcs' chairs and the auditors' chairs and so forth and they handle it from there. And they've always been very good at this.

So that's something auditors do well. Now, it could possibly be improved by having a meter, a line and a bunch of electronic gear and a microphone and all that sort of thing. Probably this could all be improved in that particular way.

Is it justified to do so? That is my only question. Because the direction of research which is where I hope it will wind up, will be in the direction of not requiring it.

The way you handle a co-audit, the way you've always handled HAS Co-audits, you'd handle them all the same way. Be the same old pattern. It's gotten creaky.

If you don't know it, ask somebody who's run one. There must be a dozen people here who've run them for months and months and months or years on end. See, you just put them down in the chair and, I mean, the guy's supposed to utter the auditing command, and, actually the Instructor who is present audits the lot.

It's his responsibility, and the raw meat audits beautifully as long as there's somebody there that they can put that hand out and say, “He-he-he didn't answer the question.” That's the direction of development. It's not the mechanical direction. Or not this particular direction.

We have more need of this here than in a co-audit. I would like to see supervision capable of being done in paired chairs in a room here, in the Z Unit only. Boy, you know, you're awful lucky, those of you who are leaving.

You're terribly fortunate that you got through the Y Unit. Because you know, probably never again in the history of Saint Hill will anybody get through the Y Unit. Do you realize that?

Isn't that sad? Do you know what the Y Unit, those coming up to the Y Unit face? Some people face firing squads.

Others face other things. But the people who are coming up the line now are not going to get out of the Y Unit until they get a clean needle on their pc with the pc's tone arm at the Clear read. And when they've got their pc like that, they get out of the Y Unit.

Do it with the meter, I mean, we're not going to keep meterless auditing in, see? Going to be very  Q & A PERIOD: 9  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS standard auditing and probably never again will anybody ever get into the Z Unit. I thought you would be cheered.

That puts a – puts a cheery light on your termination here. See, you can go away with a smile now, because you at least have gotten through the Y Unit. Future concentration of auditing supervision will be the X and the Y Unit.

The X Unit is going to be tougher than the Y Unit. But we're going to let people through into the Y Unit. Up to that, the only thing that lets a person out of the Y Unit is pc's TA at Clear read – needle clean, free, pc's goal has already come up, it's all ready to be listed – on the second goal.

No, we're not going to be quite that extreme. We don't absolutely demand that the pc's goal have come up in the Y Unit. Also the Y Unit's auditing hours are going to be expanded enormously.

There'll be a minimum of twelve hours a week in the Y Unit – minimum – given and received. Because that's where auditing skill deteriorated here a little bit – was in the Y Unit, see? So we just go to extremes and let it ride that way and let people cope with it.

So you're awful lucky to get out of here. That's all I can answer off of that one. Let's see another one here. “When a t-e-r . . .” I suppose that's terminal, “in the bank is visible to the pc and it is constant, can this be used as a shortcut to the goal?” That isn't any guarantee that that is the goals terminal.

That is no guarantee that it is a terminal. It will have the goal somewhere in it. Now, how it could be used as a shortcut of the goal – if it's identified and if it is checked out with a rock slam and if these other things are true – that is, if standard procedure also backs this up – yeah, that'd be a very, very likely terminal.

That would be a honey. If it's backed up with everything else. It, of course, every item you know has its own goal.

Doesn't necessarily rocket read or anything like that. But it's quite amusing that if you have – if you have a rock slamming reliable item and it's “a tiger,” see. And there it is, rock slamming item, “tiger,” and everything's fine, you've got it, found it, reliable.

And it's a terminal. If you listed its goals, amongst its goals you would find its goal. Before every engram a person had a goal.

Before every difficulty in life that he was confronting he had a goal. And similarly, every valence and item he runs into has a goal. And the weird part of it is if that goal is very, very close to the main channel goal, it'll rocket read – once, twice, six, eight times.

And folds up, and you never see it again. Did you ever notice in going down a long goals list that you'll strike goals occasionally that rocket read? It goes pssww!

There it is, there's a goal rocket reading. And you check it, and by golly, it'll go pssww! You say, “Boy, that's really something, you know,” and you tiger drill the thing out, and you trot out Big Tiger, and you're going to groom this whole thing up, and it goes, pssww!

And then it goes tick. And then it stops. And you say, “On this goal, has anything been suppressed?” No read. “On this goal, anything you have been careful of?” No read. “To catch catfish.” No read.

Sad story. I mean, a lot of you have attended the funeral of goals that went like that. Well, what  Q & A PERIOD: 10  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS you've struck there is the central goal of one of these items.

You see, it's on the channel of the goal, see? It's very close to the goal. It's not much use to you till after the case is Clear.

You could go back and see this circled X, and you could say, “What relationship did this goal have, 'to spit,' have to do with 'catching catfish'?” you see? “What was the relationship between these two goals?” And he could tell you. Well, naturally the best way to catch catfish is you spit first and that tells you whether or not you're going to be lucky or not, see? And he tells you all about it.

Doesn't do you a bit of good. At the time you first find this he won't be able to integrate it worth a nickel, he'll give you some wild tale. And he actually doesn't know which way to go to find these goals.

But do you understand what I mean? Occasionally these things'll rocket read. And it's quite amusing.

It's not really amusing, after you've seen four or five or six rocket reads or even eight or ten rocket reads, off of some item, and you're big tiger drilling it, and everything is fine and you're going to come back and you check it, and you come back the next morning and you check it and it doesn't do anything. It goes tick and phumph. And then you prepcheck it, you know, and you keeps asking the pc, “Do you have a pain?

Do you have a pain?” you know? Pc keeps saying, “Yes, I do have pain, on the end of my nose,” and so forth, and the end of the session or something like that, it doesn't tick, it isn't suppressed, nothing. There are no pains, there's no sensation.

And it's gone. That's fine. That's one of the – one of the liabilities of auditing.

But that was the goal of a terminal or an oppterm. Mostly terminals rocket read, I don't know that oppterms ever rocket read. But I don't know that.

They might. Now, the sad part of it is – this is the – this – you think that's – is a sad story. Well, there's a sadder story than this.

After you've nulled another thousand goals and found thirty more items – you take all goals that went out hard and you accidentally put that goal back on the list. And you check it out and it's got pain and it rocket reads. And you look at the intervening thirty-five hours of hard labor, as totally useless.

Actually, it's not. The thing was never in a condition to rocket read till you unburdened it. But it gives you a horrible sensation.

I had this happen to me twice in Washington. Pcs were delighted and I was spitting my teeth out. “What do you mean having that goal back again? That was out three days ago!” By the way, I'll give you another parting shot on goals.

Pain reads below the meter. If there's pain on something it might not show up on the meter, but it'll show up on the pc with pain. And it is characteristic of all these goals which have faded out and then come back, that when you got the pain, (quote) all off of them (unquote), on Monday, you found pain on them on Tuesday.

And when you got it all off of them on Tuesday you found pain on them on Wednesday. And then thirty days later you've abandoned it because you cleaned it all up – and thirty days later you happened to hit it again and it's got pain on it. This isn't a – this isn't a wonderful test, because also phony goals that are almost right will follow this to some degree.

Q & A PERIOD: 11  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS But on a bad – on the wrong goal, if it's going to be the wrong goal, if the pain does persist for quite a while and you can get it several sessions and you can get pain back and all that sort of thing – it will eventually disappear and you can't get any back. But on the right goal you can never make this happen. You can never get the pain to go away and stay away.

You can get it to go away, but you can't get it to stay away. It'll be back next session, it'll be back next week, it'll be back and so on. As long as that goal remains unfound it'll continue to give the pc pain.

And that's something you might use sometime or another. It's a very, very useful point. You find an old list of goals and somebody says, “Well, I cleaned up Joe's goals.

I just got them all clean and Joe's just clean as the driven snow with his goals, see. All tiger drilled and so on, we prepchecked a couple of them, been listed all clean and so forth.” You say, “Well, that's fine, then I don't have to bother with any of those.” Boy, have you made a mistake. Go back and read your Routine 3-21.

It says you haul out the old goals, doesn't it? Why do you haul the old goals out? I'll let you in on why that step is in there.

You haul them out and you just go down them as a list. Well, if they've all been cleaned up – see, you haven't found the pc's goal yet – and they've all been cleaned up and one of them's got pain on it – it isn't that the former auditor didn't get the pain off – he did. But the pain's come back.

And boy, I would walk around that goal with the greatest of care. I'd really cuff that goal up. And I'd see, if after I got it all cleaned up, the pain came back – or if I could get it cleaned up.

And I'd be very disappointed if I could get all the pain off of it and no pain came back, because obviously from then on it's no good. But let's say those goals were all cleaned up last month and you've now got the pc to audit this month. You go down this list and so on, and there's “to catch catfish,” and it's just like all these other goals, and you read “to catch catfish,” and the pc goes ...

You say, “What's the matter?” “Well, I've got a pain.” Doesn't show on the meter. See, he – it hurts. And you just keep working it then.

Work Suppress and other things, just kind of prepcheck it, you know. Next thing you know, its showing on the meter. And two things can happen: It is either the goal or will fade out – forever.

But you mustn't omit the fact that there's a chance that it is the goal. That's why you always go over all those old goals again. Now, on doing the second goal, there's a possibility that you had it on his first goals list, but it wasn't time for it to come up and take its bow.

So it's always a good idea to go over goals that went out hard when you're looking for the second goal, as one of your first areas of action. And that's why 3-21 is written the way it is. You do everything on it that you did the first time when you're finding the second goal, including assembling all the old goals.

Actually, finding a second goal is ordinarily a very simple ... It is just exactly Routine 3-21. It is exactly what you do.

There's no variation off Routine 3-21 on the second goal. There might be on the first goal because you have to find items and unburden and work like  Q & A PERIOD: 12  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS mad and you have to do 3GA Criss Cross where Step 4 is, you see. Second goal – why, you just write yourself a list of goals and start tiger drilling that list and that goal will be on it someplace.

And you go on down the line and you might not have to find one or – more than one, two, three items and oppose them, before it's just Prehav level, Prehav level. Where's the goal? Where's the items?

Where's the mass? Where's the meter reads? Dust it off with a Prepcheck and there she goes – she's gone.

Second goal, by our experience, goes much, much faster. Oh, I don't know, by about a tenth, or a twentieth as fast as the first goal. And there's just that much reduction ratio apparently on the third goal.

Fourth goal may start to go by inspection. What's your goal? And he says, “To catch waterbucks.” You say, “All right, let's check that out on the meter.

Let's check it out on the meter. We're going to check it out on the meter now. All right, here you go: 'To catch waterbucks.

To catch waterbucks.' Well, let's write a goals list.” You're already doing the fifth goal and you don't even know you're doing the fifth goal – the fourth one blew, see? It had – it had three fires in it and they all went before you put him on the meter. Horrible, huh?

All right, here's another question. “How do you know which buttons of 19 buttons to use, when testing for pain or sen?” You don't use any buttons for testing for pain or sen. You don't use any buttons for testing for pain or sen. You don't test for pain or sen on buttons.

Where did this come from? Who said this? What happened?

Female voice: It's in a bulletin. It's in the bulletin on pain and sen. Must be a misprint.

Must be a misprint. I don't mean to shame you. But I will tell you exactly how you test for it.

You test for pain and sen only by saying the terminal or the oppterm, the item, to the pc. Now, there's numerous ways you can say it. You could say – you think it's an oppterm – so you say, “Would you consider – or would you – would you commit overts against a blank?” That's another way of saying it.

If it's a terminal, well, “Would a blank commit overts?” That's just other ways of saying it. What do you want to do there is you want to just say it. You say all right, you say, “Hangman.

Hangman. Hangman. Hangman.

Hangman. Hangman.” See if pain turns on. End of session.

It doesn't matter how you say it. It doesn't matter how you say it. You understand?

It doesn't matter how you say the item. But the only way you test the item – the only way you test the item is by saying the item. There are no buttons.

The one most likely to turn pain on on an item is the one most fixated on the item. And the one most likely to turn on sensation on an item is the one most fixated by the item. You'll find in every Problems Intensive one or two buttons will run hotter than the rest.

Female voice: The bulletin says you use – you could also use the seventeen buttons ... Not to test for whether it's a – not to test for pain or sen. That's just ways of asking it.

See , what she doesn't get is the first part of it is is the  Q & A PERIOD: 13  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS basic on all this is it's just the item that does it. See, it's just a – see, it's just the method of asking the item. Female voice: What she's wondering about is ...

Oh, dear! Oh, on  of this – what this mystery is all about – is she's thinking that you ask many Prehav levels for this. No, you ask the Prehav level – let's say you've listed “Who or what would determine?” Let's say “determine” was the Prehav level.

And you said, “Who or what would be – determine?” And you finally got an item, and now you want – you – you just use that “determine” in the test line. That test line – it's just “determine” would be the only one you use. But that's just a way of asking for it.

You understand? You sure you do? Female voice: Well, I-I do understand that, but it says down here – uh – you're using your buttons – the Tiger Drill buttons. . .

Female voice: She's asking you the Tiger Drill buttons, you know, like would you say “Consider protesting.” That's an overt, like a “Fail to reveal.” Listen. Listen. Don't leave this course thinking this.

But the pain or the sen has nothing to do with the button. You understand? The button has nothing to do with it.

It is the item which turns on the pain or sen and you can ask the item in various ways to get the pc's attention on the item. So we don't care what buttons or levels are used with the item, it's just a mechanism of getting the pc's attention on the item. And when – but basically it's just “Waterbuck.

Waterbuck. Waterbuck.” And he says blaahhh! – sen, see? And you say, “Tiger.

Tiger. Tiger.” Ow! – pain. That's a terminal.

Tiger – terminal: waterbuck. He's reversed. Now, you know, a reversed pc – tiger's always an oppterm.

Every Scientologist knows that. All right, that's all there is to that. That's all I can tell you about it.

But it doesn't matter, the other – it would just be a point. One thing I want you to know about all that is some people make it faster than others. And the best way – the best way to get cleared is actually to be a good auditor.

You'll find that there's a direct relationship to this in most cases. Best way to get cleared is to be a good auditor. Of course, the way to be a good auditor is to deliver a good session.

And although the averages on this sometimes don't look like this to you, there'll be a lot of people asking you this question as to how to do it all, and so forth. And although they don't sometimes look like the averages are right – you're auditing well and you're getting lousy sessions – remember that you've given some lousy sessions when you were getting good auditing too. The average balances out to a marked degree.

And the very best way to get Clear is to give good auditing. Actually and truthfully so. Those people who do not give good auditing actually, oddly enough, are those who are making the least progress.

Which I think is quite remarkable. It's sort of poetic. They sort of get averaged out along the line.

Q & A PERIOD: 14  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS But more important than that arithmetical figure is just this – you can get Clear, yes, you can get up to the first-goal Clear. But how are you going to get to the second-goal Clear? All right, that's fine.

That's fine. Now supposing you get to second-goal Clear, and you go along ten lives and so forth. Now let's ask the burning question: How are you going to get Clear?

Well, your very best chance of getting Clear ten lives from now is having given good sessions now and taught good auditing now and kept it going. Because it'll still be here and it'll still be clearing people in ten lives. I've looked at this any way I could look at it.

And I've come to the conclusion that there is no substitute for good auditing and good dissemination. And also I see very clearly that there is just this as a factor. There is no arithmetical equivalent.

There are people around who have been clearing people, who've been auditing like mad and who haven't been receiving good auditing, and the average isn't up. See, the average is not good for that particular person. Actually, to a marked degree it isn't for me.

I've gotten some lousy sessions and I've given lots of good ones. You understand? All right.

But as time goes on that could reverse, too, couldn't it? Because actually, as far as my getting OT with exclamation points is concerned – it actually totally depends on me continuing to give good sessions. Do you see from that point of view?

See? Now, whether or not I can hold out long enough to give enough good sessions to eventually have enough auditors so that I can have some auditing too, this is one of the things which I have to worry about. But nevertheless it's true.

As long as I go on auditing and giving good sessions I will someday make OT. That's the way – that's the way the cookie crumbles, that's the way the wheel turns. And if you're worried sometime, desperately worried about getting Clear or clearer or something of that sort – you're really desperately worried, then audit like hell.

See, that's my best advice to you. Because it's advice that I myself take. All right, so you've audited many times longer and far better than the auditing you have received in your opinion.

All right. Well, that's just how long you have to audit to get some. You see, who said it was an easy hill to climb?

It is not an easy hill to climb. I think with horror of some of the kids in LA, 1950, used to tell me that the ideal clearing was to be able to insert a needle into somebody's gluteus maximus and give one single shot and that would make the person Clear. And they were actually hoping that some chemical research of some kind or another would wind up ...

Well, of course, at our stage of development we know that'd be totally silly. But they thought this would be ideal clearing. Well, actually, it wouldn't be ideal clearing because it wouldn't have done anything for anybody.

It would have exteriorized them, wouldn't have returned anything to them at all. Now causation of clearing breeds clearing. And that's all I can say about it.

It does. Definitely. Now, to some degree, I have been laggardly in giving you techniques and so forth,  Q & A PERIOD: 15  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS in somebody's opinion – but in actual fact you got them about two or three thousand years before they were due.

So, give me the credit of having developed them before any normal course of research procedure would have developed them. Now, it's never an easy job to clear somebody, don't ever get the idea that it is. Don't ever try to persuade somebody that it is.

This guy walks up and “Clear” – the worst thing in the world that you can say to this person is “Oh, well, yes, yes. Just pay your money over on the right, there, and come on through here, and we'll clear you.” Honest, you would find that the person would work much better in the line of clearing – would work extremely better in the line of clearing – if you looked at him with an entirely different approach. And said, “Are you sure you want to tackle it?

It's a hard road. Once in a while somebody is just terribly lucky and finds it fairly easy, but ordinarily it's a very, very rough road. It has its ups and downs and it has its heartbreaks and it has this and that.

The end product, well, if you stay with it, it can be delivered. It's well worth having at the other end of the line. Well worth having.

But we don't want you coming into this co-audit or we don't want you coming into this HGC thinking that this is an easy thing to do. That all you have to do is roll up your sleeve and we punch you with a little needle and you are promptly Clear. Because that isn't the way it goes.

Now, as long as you've lived and as much as you've done, how could it be easy?” Person says, “Well, there's something to what you say.” That it can be done at all is absolutely miraculous. Because it's never been done before on this planet. Never.

So their approach to clearing, of course, is in the degree they seek clearing with the ease to the degree that they themselves cannot confront furnishing any effort. See, if the person can furnish no effort, can have no causative action of any kind whatsoever, you'll also find the person has never done anything, ever. And then you will find in addition to that, that this individual has also the longest road to go.

The individual who's seeking the shortest route has the longest road to go. And the first way and easiest way you could break somebody's heart, now that we – you know that people don't clear easily – and I think most of you've got a high reality on it that they can go Clean You see yourselves approaching this on a gradient. It's a reality that it exists.

But you make it harder for somebody telling him how easy it is. Because he has the heartbreak – I can tell you this out of experience, of telling them all ways – all the different ways you can tell him. But he'd have the heartbreak of learning out that it was a tough road, having counted on it being an easy road.

Now, I think you would get a far better response from people if when they said, “Well, that's fine, now here's all this money and I've got five hundred and sixty-two pounds and I want you to audit me and I want you to get this wonderful thing called clearing, and so forth. . .” And so you say, “Oh, nothing to that. Sit down in the chair, and so forth. And here's  Q & A PERIOD: 16  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS the receipt and everything's fine.” Instead of you going something like – just let the five hundred and twenty pounds sit right on the front of the desk.

Just don't touch it, see. Have him sit down and say, “This – I want you to understand this. This is not an easy road.

This is a tough road. It is not a short road. Its end product exceeds anything that has ever been exceeded – but it is not an easy road to travel.

And it's going to have ups and downs and it's going to have heartbreaks.” And if that person puts that five hundred and twenty pounds back in his pocket and walks out the door, thank your stars he did. Because it would have cost you a thousand pounds in time to have gotten an adequate result. You see the difference here?

Now, there's a difference between certain clearing and easy clearing. Do you know the world wants from us – to know that we are doing something about things? You know, that's really what the world wants from us, that we are actually doing things about things.

We're doing something about the world, we're doing something about man. We do know where we're going, we are getting someplace, we are making progress and so forth. We actually are living up to that degree of what people expect of us.

Don't add to our burdens the fact that with a snap of the fingers, they're going to all be Clear. Because it isn't true and it never will be true. If it's only just the somatics a person is experiencing during the period of clearing, it'd drive most people off.

They say they know they've got to go on through it, but do they have to? Now, people expect of us to go on forward and do something about it. Yes, we're going on forward, we're doing something about it.

We're doing something about it in a remarkably short period of time. This is very remarkable. That something can be done about it, proportional to the skill of administration of the technology, is absolutely certain.

Things can be done. The only thing that's letting us down at all today is weak or imperfect application of technology, providing the auditor is willing to realize that a few lines dead-end and a few terminals don't represent and that he can get skunked and lay an egg and go on in and pitch again. He knows he can carve his way out.

Sometimes goals are hard to find, sometimes the goals are easy to find. One fellow, the first goal he found on somebody took him fifty hours. Next goal took him three hours.

Was that because he was more skilled? No. No, it just happened to be in a difference between the pcs.

Next goal's going to take him seventy-five hours, maybe. But the point I am making here is the goal can be attained. And if you tell people with that certainty we have attained it, we can attain it and it is attainable – and don't interpret that as something that is easy to do, because it is not.

If it were easy to do, it would have been done many, many times before in man's history. And it's never been done in man's history. So, of course, a fellow has to be smart to do it, and of course it is a rough thing to do.

Now, there's where you sit on dissemination, and you sit along those lines – you'll be far, far better off than saying, “Well, all you have to do is sit down in the chair and I'm going  Q & A PERIOD: 17  DISTRICT OFFICES, CO-AUDITS to make a few magic passes.” Seventy-five hours later, well, you're still making those few magic passes. You're heart's broken and now so is the pc's. So you told him it was a hard road and he gave you his goal in the second hour.

And he listed out in twelve. So you made a liar out of yourself. Well, anytime you want to make a liar out of yourself that way, do so.

It's the other way that you can't retract. Well, I wish you all, those of you leaving, lots of luck. I'll probably see you before you go.

And that's all we have from here tonight. Thank you very, very much.

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